Roofing Talk - Professional Roofing Contractors Forum banner

1 - 20 of 21 Posts

·
Banned
Joined
·
313 Posts
There are 3 strategies that you can choose from to guide your approach to sales.

  • Price
  • Pressure
  • Personalized service
Price: You could try to win sales based on having a low price.

Pressure: You could employ some type of high pressure tactics to get people to sign the contract

Personalized service: Or you could offer prospects personalized service. You can invest more in helping them to get the exact solution that is right for them and they will appreciate the value that you add.

Which approach makes most sense to you?

I choose to offer personalized service. Therefore I need to be aware of anything and I mean ANYTHING that will lead to further commoditization of this industry and avoid it.

Anything that you do that presents your service as a commodity means that you will have to compete on price.

If you consider “bidding” as an activity that you want to engage in then you are competing on price.

An organization that offers personalized service doesn’t “bid”. It does a needs assessment to uncover issues that are important to the prospect besides price.

It develops a dialogue with the prospect to explore the opportunity to work together on the solution to problems. It involves communication with people, face to face communication, rapport building and decision making. It does all of that and much more.

Why would you knowingly want to engage in activity that is designed to make you compete on price? There could only be one reason; you have designed your company to be a low priced provider. There are no other reasons that make sense.

That’s why you are wasting your resources to pay a marketing organization that is geared toward commoditizing your industry.
 

·
Residential Roofer
Joined
·
227 Posts
I always saw it as all three playing off of one another, with number 3 being the one of most importance, thus the clincher in the sale.

You start off with [3] what 'you' have to offer,
throw in a little of [2] a few horror stories of premature failed roofs and the importance of proper installment of materials, ventilation and underlayments,
toss out a [1] cost of materials,
than fall back on [3] with this is what we can do for you too make sure you get both a full and properly installed roofing system that will last.
 

·
Roofing Relapse
Joined
·
2,556 Posts
I want to add one more, which really isn't sales at all but a strategy alot of guys employ. Throwing a ton of crap at the wall and seeing what sticks. I know of one company providing their guys 10+ leads per day. They measure and figure the proposal real quick and give it to the secretaries to type who are putting out about 140 proposals in the mail each day. This company runs about 10 crews per day, well they did back when I was doing their scheduling I assume it's still in the same range now too.

Their closing ratio is crap but they do charge a pretty good rate for their work and are keeping alot of guys busy. When I was there, there were numerous sales reps earning over $100k per year and most of them were above the $75k mark. I call them sales reps, but the company policy is NOT to meet the customer unless the customer insists.

The point to this post is that I don't agree that bidding is always competing on price, though in most situations it is. I am a "sorta-seller" as defined by CertainTeed. That's a cross between personalized service, and bidding. Low price has absolutely nothing to do with it...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
755 Posts
Jack,

That doesn't seem like your writing style. If so, very well thought out for a topic based on the 3 parameters defined, which I expect of you.

The topic for discussion is definitely something that you discuss very tangibly, but just the formatting of this piece seems like it may have been acquired from some sales guru type newsletter.

But, if it is from some other source, you should give credit and a link to the source.

Ed
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
313 Posts
Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Jack,

That doesn't seem like your writing style. If so, very well thought out for a topic based on the 3 parameters defined, which I expect of you.

The topic for discussion is definitely something that you discuss very tangibly, but just the formatting of this piece seems like it may have been acquired from some sales guru type newsletter.

But, if it is from some other source, you should give credit and a link to the source.

Ed

Ed, its stuff I've learned from various sources, mainly from listening to audio CD’s while I drive, and also from live Sandler sales training.

These thoughts were elaborated on by David Allen Yoho; He has an audio CD called “Negotiating Higher Prices in Competitive markets”.

Someday I’ll give you a list of Books and audio books that I recommend.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
755 Posts
Ed, its stuff I've learned from various sources, mainly from listening to audio CD’s while I drive, and also from live Sandler sales training.

These thoughts were elaborated on by David Allen Yoho; He has an audio CD called “Negotiating Higher Prices in Competitive markets”.

Someday I’ll give you a list of Books and audio books that I recommend.
I am on his e-mail list, but the stuff he sends out has not been worth it yet, except for his Guide To Replacemernt Windows e-book, just for some general knowledge and tips.

Ed
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
313 Posts
Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Your threads are always worth reading Jack, just like Ed's.

Is my assumption/opinion that it's all 3 methods playing off each other with one simply over powering the others acceptable?
If you decide to compete on price that will affect decisions that you make in other aspects of your business.

It will influence what you pay your installers for example; it will influence your specifications for how the job will be done and other things.

In true selling/marketing you want the price to be detached from the product or service. You want the prospect to buy based on how they feel about the experience.

It’s not about the thing you are selling; it’s about how they feel about you, your company, your products and services.

You don’t want the prospect to focus on a direct link between the product/service and the price. If they maintain that focus then they will decide to go with the lowest priced contractor.

You can steer them toward deciding based on personalized service by offering better service than the run of the mill contractor, but it has to be service that creates value in their mind.

Not every prospect is going to appreciate a more professional level of service. However you can try to market in neighborhoods that are more affluent and more educated and you will minimize that problem.

There are some easy things you can do to create more value. You can do an attic inspection compared to other contractors that don’t. Suppose you do and you find a bathroom fan that is not connected to a vent and mildew in the attic.
Suppose you are the only contractor to tell them how to get proper airflow to avoid mildew.

That’s just one example of being different. You could also do other work that needs to be done so that the customer can take advantage of one stop shopping. You could add insulation or do chimney repairs or something like that. Your competitors may not even notice that they need these things. You can take a camera with you and show them pictures of why they need these other items.

You can take more time and educate the prospect and that creates value.

If you create a lot more value than your competition the prospect will not object to paying you more money.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
313 Posts
Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Paper Boy or Professional Roofer?

Is the information you provide more valuable that the morning newspaper?

Some contractors are contemplating on how they can deliver quotes on a mass scale by outsourcing the measuring.

I guess you could prepare quotes, roll them up and put a rubber band around them, pack them into a saddle bag, place the saddle bag on a bike and pay some kid to ride around and drop them off lie he is dropping off the morning paper.

If you want to deliver quotes like it’s no more important than the morning paper you are placing yourself in a position of getting jobs only because you have a low price.

Do you provide expert advice and evaluation to your prospects?

Do you have a quality control system in place to guarantee that the customer gets what you promised?

If you do why would you want to place your self on the same level as a paper boy?
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
313 Posts
Discussion Starter · #10 · (Edited)
Your threads are always worth reading Jack, just like Ed's.

Is my assumption/opinion that it's all 3 methods playing off each other with one simply over powering the others acceptable?
I don’t like to use pressure but that does not mean I am afraid to ask for a yes or no decision.

The main point here is that the customer will have a reason for choosing you that stands out as the main reason.

If you specialize in low price roofing then you don’t need a lot of selling skills, you only have to keep quoting low prices.

If you charge higher prices and deliver higher quality then you have to have a way to persuade the prospect to pay you more.

That’s where personalized service comes in. You are offering personalized service before, during and after the job is completed.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
755 Posts
Ed, its stuff I've learned from various sources, mainly from listening to audio CD’s while I drive, and also from live Sandler sales training.

These thoughts were elaborated on by David Allen Yoho; He has an audio CD called “Negotiating Higher Prices in Competitive markets”.

Someday I’ll give you a list of Books and audio books that I recommend.
Jack,

Do you have any copies of those CD's you could loan out?

Maybe we could create a library of resources to share between the members that have various collections.

Ed
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
75 Posts
There are 3 strategies that you can choose from to guide your approach to sales.

  • Price
  • Pressure
  • Personalized service
Price: You could try to win sales based on having a low price.

Pressure: You could employ some type of high pressure tactics to get people to sign the contract

Personalized service: Or you could offer prospects personalized service. You can invest more in helping them to get the exact solution that is right for them and they will appreciate the value that you add.

Which approach makes most sense to you?

I choose to offer personalized service. Therefore I need to be aware of anything and I mean ANYTHING that will lead to further commoditization of this industry and avoid it.

Anything that you do that presents your service as a commodity means that you will have to compete on price.

If you consider “bidding” as an activity that you want to engage in then you are competing on price.

An organization that offers personalized service doesn’t “bid”. It does a needs assessment to uncover issues that are important to the prospect besides price.

It develops a dialogue with the prospect to explore the opportunity to work together on the solution to problems. It involves communication with people, face to face communication, rapport building and decision making. It does all of that and much more.

Why would you knowingly want to engage in activity that is designed to make you compete on price? There could only be one reason; you have designed your company to be a low priced provider. There are no other reasons that make sense.

That’s why you are wasting your resources to pay a marketing organization that is geared toward commoditizing your industry.
Good point.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
75 Posts
I want to add one more, which really isn't sales at all but a strategy alot of guys employ. Throwing a ton of crap at the wall and seeing what sticks. I know of one company providing their guys 10+ leads per day. They measure and figure the proposal real quick and give it to the secretaries to type who are putting out about 140 proposals in the mail each day. This company runs about 10 crews per day, well they did back when I was doing their scheduling I assume it's still in the same range now too.

Their closing ratio is crap but they do charge a pretty good rate for their work and are keeping alot of guys busy. When I was there, there were numerous sales reps earning over $100k per year and most of them were above the $75k mark. I call them sales reps, but the company policy is NOT to meet the customer unless the customer insists.

The point to this post is that I don't agree that bidding is always competing on price, though in most situations it is. I am a "sorta-seller" as defined by CertainTeed. That's a cross between personalized service, and bidding. Low price has absolutely nothing to do with it...
I agree. Our % of closings are about 60%. We keep 20 + jobs on the board all summer. We do 5 roofs, 5 more come in. I think it is because I do all the estimates and meet with the home owner in person.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3 Posts
Although I'm in the research stage of getting into roofing sales, I've taken an approach in other areas of selling that disqualifies customers. I want to know if I want "that person" as a client. I put a great deal of effort into getting all my ducks in a row so I can do business with integrity and be a visible and valuable part of my community, and I expect my clients to do the the same. The worst part of roofing sales is after investing time and money to put a quote together and then you have the "client" using it to get lower prices. How many people here have ever calculated the true cost of a sales call/quote?

Below is an excerpt from "High Probability Selling" by Jacques Werth
www.highprobsell.com

The Best Salespeople, the Top 1%, utilize a precise, highly organized sales process that leaves very little to chance. Each step of the sales process increases the probability of successfully closing the sale.
Here's the dictionary definition of PROCESS: A uniform series of actions designed to produce a specific outcome. In High Probability Selling, the ultimate "specific outcome" is to close the sale; the "series of actions" are the linear steps of the sales process. We train salespeople to use the Sales Questionnaire as a tool to keep the sales process efficiently on track.
For example, you’re on your first appointment with a prospect. If you’ve used High Probability Prospecting, before the meeting your prospect agreed to the following: 1) to give you and hour of uninterrupted time; 2) he wants what you’re selling; and 3) he’ll buy- if you can meet his requirements for doing so. You begin to methodically get answers and fill in your Sales Questionnaire: The first series of questions ask the prospect to confirm his intention to do business (confirm he’s in ‘Buying Mode’). The next series asks the prospect to confirm his intention to buy from you- if you can mutually agree on terms.
At this point, you believe that you have a qualified prospect, with respect to their buying intentions and available budget. Next, you want to make sure that the prospect is trustworthy. If you're like 84% of people in the business world, Trust is the most important factor when deciding whether or not to do business with someone. You want to be able to trust and respect your customer, and they want to trust and respect you as well. To determine your prospect's trustworthiness, initiate the Trust and Respect Inquiry. Unless they're one of the 4 to 8% who cannot earn your trust and respect, proceed with the next steps in the sales process.
Clarify this prospect's role in purchasing your product and service. This is a familiar part of the sales process to all experienced salespeople: You want to make sure your prospect is the real Decision Maker and has purchasing authority. It's pointless to waste time in a meeting with someone who can't buy.
After you've confirmed that you/re dealing with a trustworthy person who has purchasing authority, it's time to determine what they really want. These are your prospect's Conditions of Satisfaction: products and services specifications, delivery times, pricing, etc. Note that each time your prospects give you one of their conditions for the sale, they must also give you conditional commitment to purchase- if you can meet their terms.
At this point, it is highly probable that you will do business with your prospect. When you follow the sales process step-by-step sequentially, the prospects tend to "close themselves." They've made it clear what they want, and you've made it clear that you can provide it. Each step along the way, the prospect has confirmed his intention to do business with you.
Note that there are no "magic bullets" in High Probability Selling. There are no "Killer Closes." Nothing is left to chance: You, the salesperson, control the entire sales process. By utilizing a structured sales process, you stack the odds in your favor, negotiate agreements that usually create satisfied customers and clients, and ensure the probability of your success.
 

·
StartARoofingBusiness
Joined
·
168 Posts
Using A Closing System - Sell And Get The Check!

I would reccommend using a closing system, so you will have predictable results, and overcome the objections.

If you want to make money you need to close the sales, not just give the job away with the lowest price.

1. Price - The price should be the simple formula materials + labor + profit = total job cost.
2. Pressure - Pressure is not charging enough for the job so you can pay your bills.
3. Personalized service - Using the best talent in your area and paying them well for the hard job of roofing.
Look, the home owner call YOU to install a new roof, if you don't sell yourself, and your company, and close the deal you let the home owner down. I never talk about the completion in the home, and always about when are we starting the job.

Price does not matter, if you think your job is expensive you better close your doors. Listen to what the home owner wants and build your sales presentation around those topics....Hope This Helps!..:)
Check Out This Website For More Helpful information.
There are 3 strategies that you can choose from to guide your approach to sales.


  • Price
  • Pressure
  • Personalized service
Price: You could try to win sales based on having a low price.

Pressure: You could employ some type of high pressure tactics to get people to sign the contract

Personalized service: Or you could offer prospects personalized service. You can invest more in helping them to get the exact solution that is right for them and they will appreciate the value that you add.

Which approach makes most sense to you?

I choose to offer personalized service. Therefore I need to be aware of anything and I mean ANYTHING that will lead to further commoditization of this industry and avoid it.

Anything that you do that presents your service as a commodity means that you will have to compete on price.

If you consider “bidding” as an activity that you want to engage in then you are competing on price.

An organization that offers personalized service doesn’t “bid”. It does a needs assessment to uncover issues that are important to the prospect besides price.

It develops a dialogue with the prospect to explore the opportunity to work together on the solution to problems. It involves communication with people, face to face communication, rapport building and decision making. It does all of that and much more.

Why would you knowingly want to engage in activity that is designed to make you compete on price? There could only be one reason; you have designed your company to be a low priced provider. There are no other reasons that make sense.

That’s why you are wasting your resources to pay a marketing organization that is geared toward commoditizing your industry.
 

·
StartARoofingBusiness
Joined
·
168 Posts
Great Information

:thumbup: Great Information.... Well Said

Although I'm in the research stage of getting into roofing sales, I've taken an approach in other areas of selling that disqualifies customers. I want to know if I want "that person" as a client. I put a great deal of effort into getting all my ducks in a row so I can do business with integrity and be a visible and valuable part of my community, and I expect my clients to do the the same. The worst part of roofing sales is after investing time and money to put a quote together and then you have the "client" using it to get lower prices. How many people here have ever calculated the true cost of a sales call/quote?

Below is an excerpt from "High Probability Selling" by Jacques Werth
www.highprobsell.com

The Best Salespeople, the Top 1%, utilize a precise, highly organized sales process that leaves very little to chance. Each step of the sales process increases the probability of successfully closing the sale.
Here's the dictionary definition of PROCESS: A uniform series of actions designed to produce a specific outcome. In High Probability Selling, the ultimate "specific outcome" is to close the sale; the "series of actions" are the linear steps of the sales process. We train salespeople to use the Sales Questionnaire as a tool to keep the sales process efficiently on track.
For example, you’re on your first appointment with a prospect. If you’ve used High Probability Prospecting, before the meeting your prospect agreed to the following: 1) to give you and hour of uninterrupted time; 2) he wants what you’re selling; and 3) he’ll buy- if you can meet his requirements for doing so. You begin to methodically get answers and fill in your Sales Questionnaire: The first series of questions ask the prospect to confirm his intention to do business (confirm he’s in ‘Buying Mode’). The next series asks the prospect to confirm his intention to buy from you- if you can mutually agree on terms.
At this point, you believe that you have a qualified prospect, with respect to their buying intentions and available budget. Next, you want to make sure that the prospect is trustworthy. If you're like 84% of people in the business world, Trust is the most important factor when deciding whether or not to do business with someone. You want to be able to trust and respect your customer, and they want to trust and respect you as well. To determine your prospect's trustworthiness, initiate the Trust and Respect Inquiry. Unless they're one of the 4 to 8% who cannot earn your trust and respect, proceed with the next steps in the sales process.
Clarify this prospect's role in purchasing your product and service. This is a familiar part of the sales process to all experienced salespeople: You want to make sure your prospect is the real Decision Maker and has purchasing authority. It's pointless to waste time in a meeting with someone who can't buy.
After you've confirmed that you/re dealing with a trustworthy person who has purchasing authority, it's time to determine what they really want. These are your prospect's Conditions of Satisfaction: products and services specifications, delivery times, pricing, etc. Note that each time your prospects give you one of their conditions for the sale, they must also give you conditional commitment to purchase- if you can meet their terms.
At this point, it is highly probable that you will do business with your prospect. When you follow the sales process step-by-step sequentially, the prospects tend to "close themselves." They've made it clear what they want, and you've made it clear that you can provide it. Each step along the way, the prospect has confirmed his intention to do business with you.
Note that there are no "magic bullets" in High Probability Selling. There are no "Killer Closes." Nothing is left to chance: You, the salesperson, control the entire sales process. By utilizing a structured sales process, you stack the odds in your favor, negotiate agreements that usually create satisfied customers and clients, and ensure the probability of your success.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3 Posts
Hey Grumpy! if I've broken any forum rules, by all means delete the post. As I said, I'm looking to get into selling roofing and found this thread. I have no relationship with the author or seller of "that system" and stand to gain nothing if anyone goes to their website. In fact, I may have technically violated a copyright. That's why I cited my source.
I am looking for a "fit" with a company that may be willing to take some creative approaches in selling to this market. I haven't gotten far but I suspect that the sales side of this industry has its share of "pit bull closers". Certainly that's what every sales manager wants. It's funny how the Craigslist ads mostly say they want "Top Closers", "The Best of the Best", and so on.
Well, at a strong and healthy 61, I've been around long enough to know that "the good ones" are working with the best companies. You know, kinda like when you're lookin' for a woman, the good ones are already taken, LOL
In my extensive internet research, I've found some companies that on their sites and videos tout longevity and integrity and top notch customer service.
Being in the Auto Glass business, these seem to be, for the most part, the companies that also have their own leased fleet of company trucks. As opposed to a mish mash of trucks with magnetic signs and out of state plates. Not that there's anything wrong with that!
The networking I do in auto glass is to help folks whenever I can with things that may help them be successful.
As I approach the roofing business, I'm already benefiting by the enormous amount of valuable information available here and on the net.
So my real reason for posting about high probability selling was to see if anyone in roofing had ever heard of it and might talk about it or any other creative selling.
 

·
StartARoofingBusiness
Joined
·
168 Posts
Agreement On Need

Great Information: Agreement On Need (get an understanding and agreement of the remolding needs, goals and their real objectives).

  • Review the qualification questions and ask if this is correct?
  • Ask and get a commitment of products and service.
  • As I understand it you are looking for (A quality product and expert installation) is that correct?
  • Do you like these products and want them on your home (Review the home improvement package they have chosen and any details).


There are 3 strategies that you can choose from to guide your approach to sales.

  • Price
  • Pressure
  • Personalized service
Price: You could try to win sales based on having a low price.

Pressure: You could employ some type of high pressure tactics to get people to sign the contract

Personalized service: Or you could offer prospects personalized service. You can invest more in helping them to get the exact solution that is right for them and they will appreciate the value that you add.

Which approach makes most sense to you?

I choose to offer personalized service. Therefore I need to be aware of anything and I mean ANYTHING that will lead to further commoditization of this industry and avoid it.

Anything that you do that presents your service as a commodity means that you will have to compete on price.

If you consider “bidding” as an activity that you want to engage in then you are competing on price.

An organization that offers personalized service doesn’t “bid”. It does a needs assessment to uncover issues that are important to the prospect besides price.

It develops a dialogue with the prospect to explore the opportunity to work together on the solution to problems. It involves communication with people, face to face communication, rapport building and decision making. It does all of that and much more.

Why would you knowingly want to engage in activity that is designed to make you compete on price? There could only be one reason; you have designed your company to be a low priced provider. There are no other reasons that make sense.

That’s why you are wasting your resources to pay a marketing organization that is geared toward commoditizing your industry.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3 Posts
Thank you David!
I purchased and watched the 7-step video just now and find that your system closely parallels what is described in "high probability selling".
The elements of rapport building and creating commitment are obviously essential in any highly consultative selling.
Speaking of commitment, just yesterday, we were hit with a tornado/hail storm with BASEBALL size hail just 4 miles east of where I live in Brighton Colorado and within an hour, Craigslist "exploded" with ads for salesmen/canvassers.
I woke up this morning and knew it was time to download this program and get started.
As I go through it I'm keeping notes on the areas I need to know when I hook up with a good company.
So far, it's product knowledge and communicating with production/customer service to insure the customer is having a quality experience.
I already have the "framework" in regards to meet and greet/rapport building and controlling the process through closing the deal.
 
1 - 20 of 21 Posts
Top