nails guns and decking

ronbryanroofing

RoofSafe,

I have the un-advantage of being 6'-5". I have troubles seeing the eyes, I snap lines 5 3/4" - 11 1/2" - 23" - 34 1/2" - 46" -
57 1/2" then set brackets. Pretty methodical but it's how I do it. Lines bottom to top never fail me as to matching the courses once I get above the obstacles and more than one roofer speeds up the process.

We use drip up here so the first 4 course are put on by matching top of cut out (3 tabs get lines every course).

Oh, or valleys are the fastest I have seen and once someone does this they never go back.

1. Weave lower pitch or smaller roof up normally. Sweep valley and snap line directly up center of valley.

2. Lay a course bottom edge to the line up the valley (works only with archs) cris-crossing one side with the other at ridge further protecting caps as they dive small ridge to main roof ( sometimes these dry and crack).

3. Main roof run plane to the valley, cutting shingle (square in length) bottom corner up (with hooker).

Valley Done. No hard cold cutting, no too deep cuts with hot summer buttery shingles and very straight!

dwightlightnin

i was watching ask this old house and they have this segment called "what is it".anyways they had this tin cone with a rope attached and apparently it was a nail facer.you dumped your nails into it and it swung around your neck so all you had to do was pull each nail out between your fingures already face so all you had to do was pull the nail and hammer away.just as long as you hit the right nail it would be great.im still looking for another,and tryin to figure out how it worked without jammin up all the time.

Ed the Roofer

It is called a "Nail Stripper".

Check out the ABC Building Supply Catalog and order one if you hand nail.

Ed

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2ndGen

2nd Generation Roofere myself (25+ years).

I remember the first time I picked up a hatchet.
I never looked back to hammers again for shingling.

I've heard the arguments about not being able to pull out nails, but with hatchets, I don't bend nails (the head is angled to land on the sloped surface of the roof far better than a hammer that is designed to his "flat" surfaces whether horizontally or vertically).

Then, nail guns.

3 letters... WOW!

I remember laying out a 20 square roof with my crew the first time I used one.
I had 2 guys with hammers laying out the first 6 courses for me
(4:12, no details except for one pair of valleys).

I shingled the field.

Eventually, I got really good at it.

I got to the point that I could nail a bundle of 3 tabs in less than a minute with someone throwing them to me.
I was able to keep this rate up consistantly for hours at a time.
I got to the point that I could lay up 12 squares by myself with a helper feeding me
and me doing all of the detail work and shingling by lunch time.

I did a 5 sq garage in 1 hour and the lady wanted a refund!

She said I did it too fast!

2ndGen

No need Grumps...make that out to 2ndGen!

LOL!

I'm good for a solid 4/hour (under the right conditions, easy 5).

2ndGen

Ok, having read through the thread, here's me:

I can literally nail down a shingle in one second.

With a helper throwing them to me (have them trained to toss it at an angle just to my left side), I can grab the shingle, place it and nail it.

Total time per shingle about 2-3 seconds on a pefect application and under ideal conditions (new work, material strategically placed on in field, good weather [like the 40-50 degree range], no drama at home to occupy my mind, etc...).

I'd basically plow through 3 squares at a time and take a quick break (but not long enough to get "cold" or to stiffen up), then I'd hope back to it for as long as I could (which is usually 3 hours straight).

To do the math and to get X amount of squares per hour based on that peformance is not so cut and dry. One has to consider different circumstances, but generally, the best I ever did was 5 2/3 sq's in less than an hour on a 95 degree day "in" the sun.

I once nailed up (but I was especially angry ate my helper who said it couldn't be done) 4 square in less than an hour on a 10:12 roof by myself (no helper).

Today, I'd be comfortable at a liesurely 3 square/hour rate with a solid 18-20 squares a day with a helper on a walkable roof with few if any details.

But those types of jobs here are few.

A heavy detail (dormer, valleys, etc...)...say, 1 sq/hr.

By hand?

My best was 4.5 sq/hour and that's with me loading the roof for me and my dad (that was another day I was working angry! LOL!).

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Whenever I do a shingle roof, I will always lay out a bundle or two with my hatchet just because I like it.

But, in the immortal words of Prince's Boss in Purple Raing..."Dit ti biniz!" (This is a business!)

And guns rule.

Roofsafe

I can't get on a roof anymore because my knees, feet and ankles have finally said "enough". I was 61 when I did my last roof, I could still nail off four (4) square an hour, notice I said nail off. Depending on the projected temperature for the day I would run my starters and rakes, then lay out ahead of me what I figured I could do before 11:am, we're usually close to 90 degrees by then in the summer, then nail it off.
Most of the work I did was by myself, I'm to picky for most guys who just want to "blow n' go". I was told several times that I could make more money if I would drop my standards, just couldn't bring myself to do that.
I could still nail off six square or better an hour, but when you add the stock time in there It came out to a comfortable 2 1/2 to three square per hour. Not to shabby for an old guy who enjoyed his work. Most of my best times were on five or six twelve roofs.
Working by myself I learned how to do a lot of things to improve my time on a roof to increase my out put, espiecialy on the steeper roofs. I developed systems that improved safety and performance on steep roofs, the less you have to move around on a steep roof to get your shingles, the less your chances are for getting hurt. Placing your shingles where you need them allows quicker dispersement, only making the moves needed to do your work quickly, safer. The last steep roof I did by myself was a 21/12, that was done eight months after a shoulder replacement that went bad, so I was practically roofing that barn with one arm. It was a 21/12 sides and 7/12 top, it was in the dead of winter, Janurary, two snow storms, but nice afternoon temps allowed me to work. I got it done in four weeks, maybe not good time by most of the standards some of you guys on here have, but I thought it was pretty good, the systems I developed helped me out big time.

2ndGen

That's about right for me too...a nice steady easy pace of a bundle every five minute (when 3/sq), take a minute rest, reposition yourself, bang out the next bundle, wash/rinse/repeat.



I once had to nail off a roof I had to do because my compressor siezed before I even started the job. Managed to do 8 squares by 11:00 am (got there at just after 8) with a good 36 feet of hips to cut and install.

Luckily, it was relatively walkable.
Weather was great.

I have to admit, there was more of a sense of accomplishment when I did it by hand.

When I do it by gun, I judge my accomplishment by how much material I lay up.

Coincidentally, I did the other side of the same roof (8 squares) in just under two hours from start to finish when I had the gun going the previous day. The other side was worse because there was a 4 story drop and I nailed the first 6 courses from the roof working my way up, but once I had layed out the first 6 courses, the field was a breeze.

Roofs like that, I generally run the first six courses straight across from end to end and then fill in the field (getting the slow work out of the way and picking up on production as I plow through one bundle after another without having to stop in the field).

idahoED

Actually Grumpy that is 14.28 sqs.per.hour. But wait let me guess, You kept up that pace for...4 mins.& 13 secs., right? How do I know? Well as a young man, I concidered myself to be the best of the best and one day I showed up at 5am., shingles,(30 yr. elk, which had to be flip flopped) AND felt loaded at the ridge of a 4 in 12, gable to gable, climbed down the ladder at 6pm. and looked up at 28 sqs. and two bundles completed! Could not finish the ridge because my right forearm was cramping too bad. But the shingles, FINISHED. That is 2 and 1/4 sqs. per hour. But that was for 13 hours. AND my story is real

Slyfox

Most shingles I ever installed,
hand nailing - 22 square in 9 hours,
gun - 22 square in 8 hours.

Hand banging go's - tap 1* 2* tap 1* 2* tap 1* 2* Tap.
Gun go's - Tap 1* Tap 1* Tap 1* Tap.

Any roofer running a hammer or a gun moving faster than that is mis-placing fasteners or skipping them.
So when you here your roofers nail gun going TapTapTapTap or their hammer going tap-tap-tap, cross your fingers.

Remember, homes are sold, new home owners don't always go back to find the roofer the previous home owners used.
There are also many cases in which the home owner who hired you won't bother going back to the roofer when the problems occur 4,5,6 plus years down the road.
So many roofers never even know their roofs failed, not to mention those jobs the home owners got for free via insurance issues and found out during the process they were lucky it happened because the roof they had wouldn't have last much longer.

I teach my guys it's better to nail 20 square a day with quality,
than 30 a day straight and neat with slanted, under/over shot fasteners.

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