user182

Do you feel that the brand name of the shingle that you sell has an impact on your close ratio?

It looks like my close ratio goes up with the Owens Corning brand name compared to CertainTeed.

I know not every prospect will view brand name as an important criteria but some of them will.

-I know most homeowners are not aware of shingle brand names but they have heard of Owens Corning because everyone knows that they make fiberglass products. As far as other brands like GAF, CertainTeed, Tamko, etc, they little brand name awareness with the average consumer.+I know most homeowners are not aware of shingle brand names but they have heard of Owens Corning because everyone knows that they make fiberglass products. As far as other brands like GAF, CertainTeed, Tamko, etc, they have little brand name awareness with the average consumer.

Grumpy

Let me ask you this. Who makes the best widget in the world?

You don't know because you are not in the widget business. It could be Acme Widgets or Besco widgets. But the widget is only one part of the machine. You are buying a completed machine from a reputable company who custom designs the machine to your standards and budgets, purchases the parts, and assembles themt o fill your needs. Do you care more who makes the widget or who builds the machine?

That's not to say that the quality of the shingle installed on the roof is not important. That is to say, as your next estimate "Would you prefer CertainTeed or Tamko shingles?" and watch them blink at you like a deer in head lights. They don't know what a certainteed or a tamko is any better than they know what a GAF is. The only real way they are going to know shingles by names and so forth is if the last roofer told them " We sell Timberlines. See how nice and architectural they are? ewww ahhh" If someone tells me they want Timberlines I tell them "Oh sure standard Architectural shingles are more the norm now a-days. I prefer Landmarks and Heritages over Timberlines, but they look very much the same. See? Look." Their reaction is time and time again "Oh yeah these do look alot alike." I then go on to explain why I prefer the Tamko and CertainTeed.

People don't often tell me what "brand" they want. They'll usually say "The ones that look nicer. Not like I have now" referrign to the 3 tabs they have now.

Besides if you are selling the shingle over your own business that's crazy. Anyone can install the same shingle. It's the installer that makes the most difference.

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-Grumpy
Chicago Gutters Chicago Roofing

OUTLAW

Amen

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http://www.ClarkRoofingAndSiding.com

user182

If I am reading you correctly, and I think I am, what you are saying is; in your experience the brand name of the product has no impact on your close ratio.

I can see why you would say that because the average homeowner has never heard of either of the companies that you are referring to.

Owens Corning is the only company that has name awareness with the consumer so there is no way for you to know if offering that product would increase your close ratio because you are not offering it.

Even if you were offering it you would not know because you probably don’t have a way to track it.

In order to know if the brand name of the product has any impact on close ratio you would have to test it find out.

For example you could rotate which brand you offer on every other appointment.

On one appointment you could offer brand A and on the next appointment offer brand B.


It’s crazy for you to assume that I am selling a product over my company.

That’s like me saying that "Grumpy is crazy for selling 30 lb. paper over his own business. Anyone can install 30 lb. paper. It's the installer that makes the difference."

MJW

Yes, the brand name plays a big role. Everyone knows the name "Timberline". There were tons of salesmen selling these, unknowing of what junk they are. Of course how would they know if they don't actually put on the shingles.

We usually will put on what the customer wants, but try to steer them in the right direction.

OC's are right near the bottom of the barrel with GAF, IMO.

Slyfox

Based on sales in my area, Tamko and GAF set at the top, OC in the middle, with Certainteed, Atlas and IKO at the bottom.

In my area, OC is the only shingle sold at Carter, 84 and other lumber yards,
as well as the only shingle sold at Lowes and Home Depot.

Thus most customers who show and actual interest in their roof, which by far most don't, they simply point at a house down the road and say they want what ever that home owner has, but for those who do actually care, they always mention / ask about OC, it's not that they see it as a better product,
but they see that damn pink panther every where they go when thier shopping for lawn tools, supplies, patio furniture, etc.

I have sample pac's from all the above mentioned manufacturers in my van and I take them all out and lean them against the side of the van so all are clearly viewable, than wait for home owners to open up with his/her questions, and go from there.


Direct answer to this post:
I have no idea if mentioning OC would make a difference in sales or not because I have never tried, but, I would guess it would due to the high exsposure of OC and that damn pink panther.
GAF doe's get some exsposure with their deck/pation materials, etc., but no one 'at least in my area' get's the exsposure that OC gets.

I am going to find out by mentioning them on every other sale for awhile and see what happens.
Going to use OC on one, than GAF, than Tamko, etc.

Edited to add: The list of most sold too least sold in my area is current, it has changed over the past few years.
Tamko and Certainteed use to sale much more equally but Tamko surpassed OC knocking them out of the top spot they use to share with GAF.

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Grumpy

I would not say it has absolutely NO impact. I will say that on very very few occasions I have had customers insist on one certain shingle, for what ever reason. I am also saying most customers have no clue, so while it might have some impact, it's so minimal.

I guess what you need to do is after the sale is made, maybe the day you are starting the job standing on the lawn with the customer watching the guys work. Have an informal survey where you ask the customer why he/she chose your company. What was the deciding factor. Who were you up against. What was the price variance. Are they pleased so far... Then when youg et to your truck fill this stuff out and have your assistant enter it into a database for tracking purposes. If you hand the customer a survey it's likley they won't take the time to fill it out but if you ask in casual conversation you do the filling out for them later on and they never even know they are part of a survey. In short, ask your customers, not us.

In regards to the 30#, it's not so much the fact that we are installing 30# infact I don't expect he customer to remember really. It's that I am hammering home points that we are doing more for them than anyone else. That's the whole purpose of my presentation. We are doing more, we are doign more, we are doing more. That's selling my company.


I don't like OC's and yes customers know the name. But they are builder grade junko and I wouldn't promote them even if it would get me one or two more sales per year, because it'll also get me one or two more call backs per year for sure.

__________________
-Grumpy
Chicago Gutters Chicago Roofing

user182

In 2007 my close ratio was 50% and in 2008 in dropped down to 26%. Now in 2009 it is back up to 50%. This is for homeowner roofing jobs.

At first I wasn’t sure what I was doing wrong in 2008. Then I realized I was offering more options. I was offering both CertainTeed shingles and Owens Corning. That way if they didn’t like the color of CertainTeed then maybe Owens Corning would have a color that they liked.

I was also offering options for exhaust venting and if they needed more soffit vents I told them how many they needed at an additional charge.

Also in 2008 I increased my workmanship warranty to lifetime.

In 2009 I changed my strategy, now I only show them shingles from 1 manufacture and anything to do with ventilation is included in the price, plus I now have financing available. I lowered my workmanship warranty down to 15 years, Making those changes got me back up to 50%.

Any way I didn’t have an exact way to track close ratio by brand name except by looking at my estimating software to see what shingle I included in the estimate. But these records are not accurate because sometimes I would offer both shingles and let them pick, I’m not going to make that mistake again. I’m only going to offer one brand if they tell me that none of the colors will work then I switch to another brand.

When I looked at about 12 estimates that included Owens Corning the close ratio was around 70%. That’s why I started thinking about the brand name issue.

Once in a while I get referrals from a Manufacturer’s website. So far this year I have received 3 from Owens Corning and I sold 2 of them. I don’t think I have received any from CertainTeed this year.

user182

Can you be more specific about the Owens Corning Duration shingle?

What about it makes it inferior?

I’ve used the Owens Corning product on less than 20 jobs. So far I don’t see any problems with it.

I started a thread about that product at OC Duration but did not get much input from you guys.

Owens Corning is the only company that has SureNail technology. The competitors changed their wind resistance warranty to match OC at 110 mph but they did not change the design of the product.

In fact the case could be made that CertainTeed’s wind resistance is lower now because they no longer require nailing through the double layer. Landmark now has a 1.5 inch nailing zone but no other improvements have been made to the shingle.

user182

Experience has taught me that offering products from multiple manufactures will lower my close ratio.

That’s why I recommend that you only show them samples from one manufacturer.