Sarnafil & your opinions

bpcroofing

Hi guys
Sarnafil.......the great waterproofer......or is it.
Over here all I ever see with "Sarny" is problems.I have had three jobs over the last year removing it & torching down felt.
I have a large office block with Balconies to be redone in the summer with elastomeric felt after removing the sarny.
I dont know if its the climate here but it always seems kinda brittle(not summer).
Again I dont know & suspect a lot of my experiences have been due to poor installation-but compared to EPDM-I just dont fancy it at all over here.
On the job I am re-doing with felt, the Sarnafil is used over concrete Bisons with a layer of geotextile down 1st, then Sarny, then another layer of geotextile, then Insulation boards, then packers & slabs.
The entire £8Million building is a sieve & we are having to build false roofs & have them lifted by crane up 100 ft to cover all the Sarnafil without taking out all the air-Con units ect.
What is your opinion of Sarnafil in the colder states

English Roofer

Hi Bpc, i must admit to never using Sarnfil, but i have a friend and thats all he does use, i like to use epdm but its limited in this cold weather.
Cheers
Dave

__________________
'I can resist anything but temptation'- Oscar Wilde
www.drroofing.co.uk

bpcroofing

Im not currently licenced for EPDM-Who do you recommend I get it from.There are numerous versions & Rubberbond are always canvassing me-I think that would be very expensive tho it is quality fleece backed kit.

RooferJim

I am very suprised to hear about these sarnafil problems, we do a lot of it here and it can last thirty years or more. How old is it ? was there any warranty ? what leaked ? was it the seams etc.. ? I was involved in a lot of the first sarnafil waterproofing installations at Harvad , it was an orange 80 mill membrane and we would water test it before they backfilled.

RooferJim
www.jbennetteroofing.com

bpcroofing

Seams & joints are leaking, the job hasnt been done properly, but I still feel it was the wrong choice of material for the job due to the roughness of the concrete bisons it was laid on & the slabs ect laid on top of it.
The company who did it are no longer in business & Sarnafil Deny they were licenced to do it-How else did they get the Sarnafil to start with?

I really believe its better for warmer climates & Epdm is better for colder

RooferJim

sounds like a bad install, if the seams are probed after they heat weld it you will find any voids. If the seams are welded properly they will never come apart or leak. with a PVC material problem it is usually the membrane itself that can get brittle and shatter. Trocal had this problem in the US due to the fact that it was a unreinforced membrane that was prone to plastisizer loss in cold weather. Sarnafil has had almost zero problems due to faulty material, its almost always bad install.

Rooferjim
www.jbennetteroofing.com

bpcroofing

RJ
The problem on these particular roofs are that the geotextiles above & below the Sarnafil are soaking with water, freezing & creating no end of problems-Its regularly been below freezing here for three months now, worst winter in Scotland on record since 1962.Snow has been on the ground now for about the same amount of time.
And The Earth is heating up we are told.
So many Builders/Roofers have been affected & many are no longer trading.
In my local town we had about 120 men employed in the Roofing Industry-Its now down to about 20.
No Cementwork, Building, Slates & Rooftiles frozen together-Its been a nightmare here.
We are ok but are fortunate in many ways.

RooferJim

Sorry to hear about that bro, the economy really sucks over hear as well. we are working but we made a lot more money ten years ago. I was in Scotland once. I would love to visit again some day "to check out your roofs".

Rooferjim
www.jbennetteroofing.com

bpcroofing

Thanks Jim
I was reading on "The Roofing Channel" these guys from the States-5 or 6 of them who regularly "crew" work together-come over here & work for "NOTHING" in a kind of "Busmans Holiday"
They get set up helping/laying traditional Scotch Slate or Stone slates/flags & love doing it so much they save up for flights/accomodation & work through it for nothing.
I just cant get my head round this at all!!!
I mean Jim-if someone were to offer me four weeks rent/accomodation but I had to go out & lay shingles all day for them I really dont fancy it much.

RooferJim

Ha ha, that is funny. When I travel I always look at the roofs, and one time climed up the staging down in Aruba to talk to there roofing crew, they didnt speak good english and I think they thought I was nuts. If I am fortunate enough to visit scotland again some day , I think I would like to check out the historical sites,sample the whiskey and beer, maybee some haggis and talk with some other roofers . but i aint working for free )